Host: Joining us this morning from Edge Construction is Mike. Mike, how are you doing this morning? Mike: I’m doing well. Host: We’ve got a great show ahead. We’re talking about getting the results you want as a homeowner when it comes to a remodel. Obviously, you as a contractor and the homeowner are on the same page there. You both want the project to be a success. Mike: Absolutely. We were just talking about this in one of our meetings this week. When you’re hiring for a remodeling company, you need people homeowners will feel comfortable having in their house. That’s a pretty short list if you really think about it. From our side, we’re always talking about how that translates into the homeowner experience. Host: And homeowners bring their own expertise too. They know their home, how they live, what they like, and what they don’t like. At the same time, remodelers like Edge Construction spend every day helping people solve those problems. A lot of this comes down to listening—homeowners understanding the contractor’s expertise, and contractors understanding the homeowner’s needs. Mike: Exactly. Those investments in each other happen up front. We’ve talked a lot about our design process and how long it takes, and one of the first questions I always get when I walk into a house is, “When can you start?” But that’s really jumping the gun. First, we need to go through a design process, some kind of needs assessment, and develop a scope of work. If money were no object, what would you do to your house? Maybe it’s a kitchen, maybe it’s a first-floor remodel, maybe it’s a master bath if the budget allows. We want to get all of that out on the table and start looking for clues about how you live so we can come up with designs that are not only attractive, but that truly serve you and your family well. That only happens with an investment of time. I’d be wary of a remodeler who says, “We’ll design your project today, pick everything tomorrow, start next week, and be done in a month.” That’s one way to do it, but it’s not how you get the best result for a home you love. The better the design, the longer the remodel will last. If you do something that only appeals to you in the moment and no one else, eventually somebody tears it out, and that’s not the best use of resources. Host: And compared to the lifetime of that remodel, the upfront design time is really pretty small. It may feel like a lot in the moment, but if the goal is a fantastic remodel that lasts for decades, spending a few extra weeks planning seems like a very small investment. Mike: Right. Homeowners can get frustrated with the timeline because they think it should move faster. On the construction side, though, a lot of it takes what it takes. We’re very schedule-driven, but there are always phases where a lot of prep work is happening and it doesn’t look like much is changing. Then suddenly someone comes in and lays a bunch of flooring in two days and it looks like huge progress. But before that, maybe there was mechanical work, subfloor repair, or a whole bunch of things behind the drywall and finishes that the homeowner never sees. On the design side, I like to think homeowners have a lot of control over the timeline if they’re decisive and know exactly what they want. But honestly, I’d like to meet that person. Most people think they’re decisive until they get into the design process. Then they realize they need time to react, think things through, and sit with big decisions. A year from now, nobody is going to say, “I’m really sorry we spent an extra week or two in design.” They’ll just be happy living in a beautiful space. Host: How much of getting those great results comes from experience and education? Edge Construction has a lot of both, and you continue learning through builders’ shows and other events. When people look at a picture on Houzz or Pinterest and say, “That’s really cool,” they also need to know whether the remodeler has the experience and skill to pull it off. Mike: There’s a lot that goes into it. You need design chops. Designers and homeowners work together and come up with great ideas, and often they’ll use Pinterest or Houzz as inspiration. But most of the time it’s not, “Print this photo and Mike can build it exactly.” It’s more personal than that. We want to capture the feeling and make it fit that particular home and family. That takes real design skill and the right tools. Thirty years ago, I might have said, “Give me the picture and I can build it,” but I’m still not the designer. I know what I like, and I can figure out how to build it, but coming up with the whole design concept is a different skill set. Host: That’s one of the advantages of having in-house designers and crews working together every day. You build a relationship, understand how each other work, and that has to help the success of the project. Mike: It does. A lot of remodelers call themselves design-build firms, but I think there should almost be another category—design and construction management. We really do custom design work, from whole houses down to bookcases, range hoods, kitchens, and individual details. Then we also have our own people on the ground who can do the carpentry, tile work, and specialty pieces that the design requires. To me, that’s what design-build really means. A lot of companies can manage a build, but they’re still calling someone like us to actually build it. If I were a homeowner, I’d have questions about horsepower. We have a lot of mouths to feed, a lot of food to put on tables. That means real capacity. We had a very qualified remodeler join us recently, and we were talking about an addition coming up where the roof comes off and we build a master suite above a garage. He was worried about how fast it would move, and I said, “Hold on. We have framing crews that normally build new houses for other builders. We can pull one offline and they’ll crank this out in three or four days.” That kind of capacity matters. If you sign a contract with a remodeler and they still have to go find someone to build it, that’s something homeowners should ask about. Host: And that horsepower also includes specialization. One thing that stands out at Edge Construction is that you have people who are very, very good at specific parts of the work. Mike: Yes, and I think specialization is great advice for anyone going into construction. Get really good at something. I love our framers. They work incredibly hard and they’re excellent at what they do. But you wouldn’t have them come in and do fine trim carpentry. That’s not what they want to do, and the result wouldn’t be the same. On the other hand, our trim carpenters look at their work almost like artwork. They’re putting their stamp on it. Most people may not notice the little differences, but they do. You can progress in those careers to an incredibly high level. We do a lot of staircases in this area, and we have very qualified people. There’s a difference between being able to do something and being able to do it really well. Host: That seems like one of the big differentiators. A lot of people can do a thing. The real question is whether they can do it at a very high level. Mike: Exactly. And to get there, somebody has to invest in people. We’ve talked before about companies that use employees versus companies that subcontract everything. If I subcontract framing, I’m probably not going to spend a lot of time teaching that crew, improving their technique, or setting expectations beyond the job at hand. They’re hired guns. But with our people, we bring them in, train them, talk about safety, talk about behavior on a homeowner’s property, clean-up, professionalism, and how they leave a site at the end of the day. We have lifts and equipment, and when things get muddy, we expect people to manage that. I’ve seen crews leave mud all over a driveway and road and act like it’s no big deal. That stuff matters. Host: And for people who don’t know, you are very particular about those details. Cleanliness and order really matter to you. Mike: They do. A clean job site is the first level of good construction. Even if you don’t know how well someone framed a wall, you know whether the site looks chaotic and out of control. People can feel that right away. Host: Earlier you mentioned an addition over a garage. Is that something you’re seeing more of? Mike: It depends, but it can be a really great option. A lot of times, the space over a garage works very well for an addition. On one project we’re doing, it’s a tri-level, so we’ll build a stairway up into the garage area and it only takes a little garage space. Sometimes it works beautifully, and sometimes the existing framing or roofline makes it harder. But I love those projects because they’re additions we can do in winter. There’s no concrete, and we’re not opening up the whole house right away. We can get things closed in before making the connection back to the house. In general, though, additions are booming. A huge percentage of our appointments are for additions because people need more space but don’t want to give up their low interest rates and move. They’re settling into their neighborhoods, they like their schools, and they’re deciding to improve what they have instead. Host: And part of getting the result you want is really talking through your goals with the contractor and being open to different ways of achieving them. People may think they need to build out when maybe building up—or rethinking existing space—would work better. Mike: Absolutely. We spend a lot of time figuring out whether we can meet the goal within the existing footprint first. If you need more common area or another bedroom, the first place we often look is the basement. If it’s unfinished, there’s already a foundation, it’s near the mechanicals, and it’s a much more budget-friendly place to create usable space. If the basement is already finished, then we have different issues to solve. We also have to consider zoning and setbacks. If someone wants an addition that requires a variance, now we’ve got another layer of difficulty. Those rules are there for a reason, and it’s harder than it used to be to get exceptions. So we always start by figuring out what the rules are, getting it into CAD, looking at the footprint, and identifying what needs to move—mechanicals, electrical lines, air conditioners, fireplaces, whatever it might be—so that when we come back with pricing, it’s based on a realistic plan. Host: Do you do a lot of basement remodels where someone already has what used to count as a “finished” basement from the seventies or eighties and now they want to redo it? Mike: More than ever. People expect more from that space now. Years ago, finished basement square footage didn’t carry nearly the same value as upstairs square footage. Now, if it’s done well, that’s changed a lot. People are matching the quality of finishes upstairs, and sometimes even exceeding them in the basement. So there’s a lot of incentive to redo those old lower levels. A lot of those older basements were done pretty casually—paneling, not enough outlets, not enough lighting, questionable insulation, dated bars, and not much attention to egress or bathrooms. We can turn those spaces into something that feels like a true extension of the home. Host: The expectation of what a finished basement can be has changed dramatically. Mike: It really has. And because additions are expensive, I always like to see whether we can get a homeowner eighty or ninety percent of the way to their goal with existing space before we build onto the house. Sometimes an addition is absolutely the right answer, but if the basement or a reconfiguration can get you there, that may be the better use of resources. Host: We also talked about the importance of making decisions before construction starts. The more planning and selection work you do up front, the smoother the job goes once people are actually in your home doing the work. Mike: That comes from a lot of experience and, honestly, a lot of pain and suffering over the years. We do things this way because it’s better. There are still remodelers who go into construction while homeowners are making decisions on the fly, and that creates all kinds of stress. If you’re already living with noise, dust, disruption, pets, kids, and people in your house, the last thing you need is the pressure of making one more decision. I’ve seen homeowners get to the point where if they have to choose one more thing, they’re going to have a nervous breakdown. So ideally, you separate decision-making from construction as much as possible. There’s also the design side of it. Your flooring, cabinets, countertops, and tile all need to work together. You shouldn’t pick cabinets, start construction, and then try to figure out the countertop and backsplash later under deadline pressure. Too many people in this business still work with allowances, where they put a number in the contract and guess what you’ll spend later. If you go over, you pay more. If you come in under, maybe you get some money back, although that doesn’t happen very often. But the biggest issue is the stress. Host: And from a design standpoint, if you want the room to feel cohesive, you really do need those major decisions made together. Mike: Exactly. Homeowners are often surprised when we say we can’t finish a kitchen design until they pick appliances. But appliances affect layout. If you’re doing a double oven, an under-counter microwave, or a specialty unit, those all come in different sizes. We need that information for the actual footprint of the kitchen. Then there’s color and finish. White appliances, black appliances, stainless, and some of the newer gunmetal finishes all influence what cabinet colors and styles work well. Those decisions need to happen together. Host: And I have to ask, have they gotten any better with fingerprints on stainless steel? Mike: They have. The manufacturers listened to that complaint. Just like tile manufacturers worked on slipperiness and improved the products, appliance manufacturers improved stainless finishes too. Those little details matter, and they’re another reason it helps to work with people who know the products, know the process, and can help you make those decisions well.